Public Appeal To Admins, Builders And Dms

[*cryptc]

Historically (back when I was still running things, so basicly two administrations ago), there was relatively little innovation on the server content. We had special request races to let some people play something unique with manual approving process and creation, and apart from areas, there wasn't really that much new content added (after the very first influx of things like the warlock buddy)

Later, the new administrations (Agony and then Ceremorph) has been much more active in adding new content, including but not limited to new races and new classes, at a frankly astonishing rate (to my own glacial pace of adding new stuff during my time in control of the module). I'm extremely impressed with how much they've managed to add, some of which I thought wasn't possible at all, not just a function of how much work it would take.

The down side of having that much new content added and at that pace however, is that there is a much bigger chance that something might be bugged, be causing crashes or is unbalanced in some unforeseen way. This means the team quickly tries resolving such issues, and in some cases that means that some feature that some players were enjoying ends up being removed for various reasons. While that is regrettable, I think complaining players should realize that the alternative to this current situation of rapid influx of new content is that instead very little gets added, and only after very lengthy discussions of the staff and sometimes including the players.

So while I'll say that obviously not everything is perfect, I think that all things considered that there isn't a call for outrage either. Generally it's best to keep such outrage focused toward whichever issue has recently caused you problems, and try to calmly explain to the team why you think recent changes/nerfs are unwarranted, and if you can't convince the staff then unfortunately that change won't be reverted, and you will have to live with that, and hope that in whatever next new content being added, something there will make you happy again with something new to play on the server.

[*Xaxxophram]

Some of you are hinting at the social contract that is active here: if you want rapid development of new, interesting, exciting content, you have to be willing to allow 'take backs' for unforeseen circumstances. The Baldur's Gate server has a team of quality control folks which test things extensively, and as a result, things which were announced 3 years ago still haven't been implemented. It's the second biggest reason I stopped playing there. Here, the deal seems to be "We say it, we work on it, we put it in quickly, we adjust as needed." That last clause is the part of the deal people seem to forget about. I would much rather have what we have here, rather than waiting 2.5 years for the master alchemist prestige class to come out because they were concerned about the effects of potions on their economy =\

I trust the dev team to make reasonable decisions, and I don't doubt that, if some change were to seriously affect your character, you would be accommodated with a rebuild or a fair amount of banked XP. I don't know, though, as it's never happened to me. In cases where a character's core concept is damaged by a change, I'm about 100% sure that the staff has considered the repercussions of such an extreme change, and decided it was for the best. Sometimes medicine tastes awful.

Finally, we're all protected by the consent rules, so regardless of PvP imbalance or change-appearance griefing or whatever...all you have to do is say "Nope." You might need to use a few more words than that, but that's really what it comes down to, and you have recourse if someone does something outside the rules.

THAT HAVING BEEN SAID, the real reason I wanted to post here was to tell Stitches that I LOVE his avatar pic. That is the best new movie I have seen in a couple years, and everyone here should watch it. The Witch. It's a slow build, so give it time. It. Gets. Amazing.

I'mma go play this nifty game now. See you all at the Bazaar!

[*Ceremorph]

A lot of really well-thought-out comments on this thread. But with that in mind, and following cryptc's comments, I'd like to give a bit of a peek behind the curtain here at the process we go by. And what it comes down to is having multiple levels within playerbase, each of whom is involved in certain decisions.

First off is the Admins, which currently are myself, Mimi, and Ariella. Now once upon a time, the word admin meant "the buck stops here", when the admins were cryptc and Otyugh. They were the founders of the server, and nobody was going to second-guess them on their decisions because it was their server, their concept, and there were also still a lot of servers we were trying to differentiate ourselves from. Planar locations, custom race requests, and some unique options specific to the Planescape environment were the primary focus. Now, however, it's really more of a "first among equals" situation. The three of us don't really throw around any more weight than the rest of the DMs, but rather act as the deciding voice on matters where there's not a clear consensus among the DM team. And I'd like to think that all three of us have a truly vested interest in this server, simply because the server now exists as a result of a a lot of our own personal hard work. And primarily, we act not so much as "leaders" but as logistical support to our specialties: myself heading up the builder team, while Mimi and Ariella provide player support and plotline supervision for the western and eastern hemispheres.

So that brings us to the DMs, who are also all deemed to have a vested interest. It's always been a team decision who joins this group, among all of the existing DMs, and decisions have always been more or less unanimous when we add people to this team. As such, we've definitely had some of the most stability among the major servers. Several wildly popular servers have vanished without a trace, there are still some excellent worlds out there with almost no population but for a few die-hards, and other servers have died and come back from the dead. We had our own rough patch, it's true, but when you can still see the two founders active, while Stitches and myself have been involved since 2010, you'd have to say this process (compared to some other servers' "You seem cool, wanna be a DM?" policy) has, with one major exception, led to a good team and very little of the DM-side drama almost every other server has experienced. And yes, the entire DM team is involved in the shaping of the server, both in approving controversial new content, and when the decision is made to make changes to existing content. There are several forums set aside specifically for DM discussions, where we can safely discuss things like exploits, player issues, and the overall shape of the server. The big thing where it appllies to this topic is exploits, which we obviously don't want to discuss with the playerbase ("hey, here's an exploit and we're going to fix it in time for the next update, but we'll tell you exactly how to use it until then"). :D

Next we have our EMs, which (since it wasn't my idea) I can say is one of the most innovative ideas in PWs. Allowing players to share their ideas and stories with the powers of the DM client but without the resultant headaches of having to deal with player issues has not only allowed for fresh voices, but also to keep our DM team from burnout. EMs have their own dedicated forum to discuss their ongoing plots, as well as to chime in on issues involving the DM client and player interaction. Ems do not have a direct voice in what the DMs decide, but they do provide a perspective that is listened to. And of course, this team is always changing as new EMs become active while others drop off to focus on playing.

What I'm most proud of is our builder team. When I joined the server, I soon became (as far as I know it) the first person who wasn't part of initial staff to be part of the builder team (they even had to make a separate forum just for me! XD), because I had ideas for a cavern network in the elemental plane of earth and felt the hive ward could use a facelift. Since that time, I've had the pleasure to work with a lot of talented and creative people to make the server what it is today, and continue to work with them going forward to keep it fresh and exciting. Our builder team also has their own forums, where new ideas and the projects we'd like to take on are suggested, discussed, and eventually approved. Most builders post continual updates of their progress during the creative process, and this is also where the dirty details of a lot of bugfixing and balancing happens. And the team contains experts (or at least specialists!) on a variety of custom content subjects, from building and scripting to UIs and 3d modeling. Builders do not shape the direction of the server, but they absolutely shape what the experience of playing it is like. And nobody is on the builder team until they've submitted content which was approved and added.

Next is a relatively recent development, the tester team. These are regular players who make a point to help us test new featues and track down bugs. They do have a voice on the builder forums, but they're not expected to have that level of knowledge to dig out scripting errors or figure out why certain toolset bugs happen.

And finally, the playerbase itself. As I've said elsewhere, we wouldn't have a server without you, but throwing every little decision out for the entire playerbase to pipe up on is not going to be conductive to adding new content, not only because there are different types of players looking for different things, but because without context and the view of the server direction, the ability to make informed decisions simply isn't there. We absolutely do listen to the playerbase, yes... but we never respond to "whining" as a knee-jerk reaction. Rather, those things are discussed separately on the DM forums before a decision is made; in the case of the feature that engendered this thread, that decision was almost unanimous, with two dissenters who wanted it nerfed far further than it was, and one who sought a slightly lesser nerf. But either way, that decision had much less to do with what people were saying out here than with a separate conversation entirely focused on balance and the player experience.

So yes, there are a lot of working parts... and we of course welcome all comments and discussions. To those who've made it this far, thanks for listening to me ramble. Now let's all go out and have some fun!

[*rapsam2003]

@Ceremorph:
That was excellent. Thank you for sharing.

[*Whitefly]

All of my arguments are so good that people have to take notice and see the unfallible logic behind them. In fact if you all just did what I said, we'd never have any more trouble or drama ever again, because I'm so awesome. So like, it's fine if you completely ignore the rest of the playerbase, but listen to me because I'm really smart and cool.

[*Neethanial]

Hasty, adjective.
done or acting with excessive speed or urgency; hurried.
"a hasty attempt to defuse the situation"
acting with with excessive speed or insufficient consideration

Hasty, in no way, means "Let the players have it and play with it before you make a decision". Everything about the terms means Excessive, too much, too fast, not enough thinking. You know, like Ciphers and Harmonium :P
Insufficient consideration - This is a double edged sword, and one that often carries with it a certain amount of risk for the decision makers. The staff has to weigh the pros and cons, then weigh them against the entire player base, not just the handful that wants/doesn't want the decision. They also have to be the people cleaning up the potential results and/or messes that come of it. This is why changes, implementations, and decisions are discussed.
Also, a public trial isn't necessary in all things. Sometimes, common sense can do just as good a job at determining the paths we take.

[*KingLeoric]

True Seeing is still the same as in original nwn2, and works almost as in PnP. It was not 'toned down'. And even if it was (but again IT IS THE SAME AS ORIGINAL ONE) it were giving/gives mechanical advantage.

[*Embersworn]

It was toned down IC-ly by replacing it with ability that works in exactly the same way aside of the name and an icon... With absolutely no impact on RP because anyone playing a race with this ability knows that they can try to RP it anyway.


Ok, ok, I'm just nitpicking and trolling right now. It just looks a bit silly on the character sheet, that's all. Don't really impacts RP or mechanical play.


I'm already thankful for new UI feature, to finally have shapeshifters who don't look like a pile of Obsidian poo.

... even if you had no intent to play one you still had to look at them vanila ugly mugs ingame. >_<

[*wmw12]

I don't know, maybe I was raised with a different set of principles, but when the boss says "do it like this" you do it the way they said. Now, we all gripe and complain but in the end we do it the way we're told, right? This isn't really any different. Yes you can draw outside the lines from time to time but when you come up against a hard rule you suck it up and move on cause, ya know, adulting and stuff.

The truth is we all play here with the permission of the Admin and DM Gods and if they get tired of the crap they'll shut the show down. So rather than get all bent and make their jobs harder by complaining about stuff that isn't going to change, let's remember that this is a job they don't get paid to do, this is there free time and rather than calling them out openly when you have a problem you should take it to them privately. And if you don't think you should take it to them privately because you don't think any of them like you well enough or will listen to you perhaps you should take a look at yourself and think about why that might be, rather than causing a fuss openly just to stir the drama pot.

Just thinking out loud here.

[*Taihou]

For some reason, all those people, that were seen whining about how incontent they are with certain matters did nay cause thee to come to or voice the thoughts thou voiceth above, thus I must ask, if such thoughts, wmw12, weren't caused by disagreement with consequences of opinion stated above, in case reason will triumph over emotions and staff would revise their decisions?

Currently it looks like this:
*There comes a new feature* - reaction: "Booo, it's bad! Change!", in case someone says "boss is always right", reaction: "IDC"
*Feature gets changed* - someone other says: "It's bad", reaction: "Boss is always right!"

Do not misunderstand me, that was nay an intention to take the "right to decide" from "boss" person, but to voice an opinion, that may or may nay influence the decision, in case they would see the reasons under it.

In any culture, the "boss" would nay be against different opinions, especially constructive ones, being voiced and would at least consider it worth attention, if the country thou speakest of is nay DPRK of course.