Now... Some people may know now that I have an alt to Rainrix. A short iron golem that is piloted psionically by his rat familiar. Sometimes the character Rainrix has deployed a Reduce Person'd Iron Golem that is the Ikit Golem character also. He works on it in the Bazaar or sometimes fights alongside it in various places.
Now some people like the idea, and I'm sure some people might think I'm pushing the boundaries of D&D tech too far... I mean I hope it's not too weird or silly. A rat inside an iron golem, sworn to serve and protect their master and also fights with their ideals. Firstly familiars are telepathically linked with their masters anyway I believe, secondly Rainrix is a Telepath Psion so I imagine it may give him even greater communication or knowledge to apply to other things..?
The question is this though... I want wands on the golem. But not wands. I have a habit of using renamed wands to represent other arcane / alchemical / technical devices or abilities. Such as... Ikit using a wand if Isaacs Lesser Missile Storm. But instead of it being a wand it's renamed to (This is just one example):
'AF-LRAB//LS Mk III'
Yes... I name A LOT of Rainrix's equipment, inventions, or golems using this system. AF is obviously Aetherfall. LRAB stands form 'Long Range Arcana Bolts'. The LS means Left Shoulder (Stating the device is mounted in the golem's left shoulder). Mk III, well the technology was reverse engineered trial and error from an EM event a while back where Rainrix found odd Gnomish energy rifles and bought nearly everyone elses that had found one too (That were wands of Magic Missile). He had spent a while researching and reverse engineering them.
So... Right now Rainrix is carrying a bunch of these 'wands' (Or actually, technical upgrades / weapons / devices) and wants to transfer them to Ikit. I know Muling or the such is a big no no... So I was wondering how I could do this. Getting someone else to make the wands was suggested, but firstly they'd be just wands, secondly Ikit can't install them himself, thirdly Rainrix wouldn't let anyone else to modifications on Ikit (And neither would Ikit). Is there a way I can transfer them to Ikit without breaking any rules as such..? If I have to pay gold from Ikit too I'll do that (Can class the wands as being double cost due to being technical and other installation costs maybe..?). Any answer would be helpful... Thanks. I don't want to be an annoying 'exception to the rule' either... Because yeah once you start making special cases for some people it can get messy.
On another unrelated note, can Ikit gain Animal Language at some point..? The golem Player Character version, not Rainrix's familiar version. Right now all Ikit can say is *Squeak!*, or attempt to gesture... I know... My fault for picking a non-speaking character but still... They are still a rat!!! (The golem character has 1 level Wizard so it can summon the rat Ikit too ;) ).
Err any answers would be awesome... And if there are any questions or suggestions that'd be nice too. Uhm... Thanks! I mean *Squeak!*
Rainrix And Ikit
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*Mick64
- Posts: 490
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
You are allowed to "buy" from your Alt so long as you're actually -buying-. So if your myPC 1 has a McGuffin that would be nice for your myPC 2, what I'd do is list my McGuffin publicly for price X for a few days. If nobody buys it, then I'd consider it okay for myPC 2 to buy it from myPC 1 for price X.
Since you're talking about wands you have unlimited numbers of, IMO as long as you sell such wands at the same price your golem pays to the general public, it should be fine.
Since you're talking about wands you have unlimited numbers of, IMO as long as you sell such wands at the same price your golem pays to the general public, it should be fine.
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*Strawberry Jam
- Posts: 441
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Lots of stretching but here's the pen and paper breakdown.
Your familiar is not telepathic. Early on the master and familiar develop an empathic link up to 1 mile distance but it only communicates general vague emotions.
A little towards mid levels your familiar can communicate with other animals of it's kind, so other rats, 7th level. It then also is able to communicate verbally with the master, 5th level.
At level 20 your familiar only has 15 int, at level 1-2 it has 6 int.
You need to be epic level to have it cast spells for you. There's also the solicit familiar spell but it doesn't do that autonomously. Normally feats and so on to improve familiars focus more on combat readiness closer to animal companion than on utility.
A Psion's psicrystal does have a telepathic link however, it starts out with it. At 5th level it can speak telepathically with other intelligent creatures.
At 15th level, up to 1 mile the Psion can manifest powers thru the psicrystal, to cast at distance. At epic levels the psicrystal can manifest it's own powers.
There are also most feats for psicrystals, to have them function as cognizance crystals, concentrate on maintained powers, multiple crystals, embedded, or even to house the master's soul after death to rebuild it's own body. These are pretty high level uses.
You can also craft meld psicrystals with various other items like weapons. Think a lightsaber, basically.
The psicrystal also starts with a personality fragment from the psion, and later starts to warp or change it, the persona gives an improvement like a familiar does. There's an aggressive personality in some supplement material that zaps the psion for damage (lol!) but gives a combat improvement.
Technically it might be possible with a handful of feats that don't exist in the game. With some evil cruelty you might be able to embed the psicrystal into the rat's brain and put the rat inside the golem. You could manifest a persisted schism which would then use your other mind to communicate with the crystal which controls the rat which controls the golem. You would probably also need practiced manifester too so you can use persisted power metapsionics. Using bend reality I imagine you could manifest arcane spells for power points via the rat too....
The only real problem is reconciling that (1) an arcane golem is animated by the "soul" of an elemental rather than psionic, and (2) not sure your rat can activate wands. The other problem is that since you took golem master you wouldn't have the feats or the levels to pull it off.
So technically it might be possible but it would be easier and cheaper to just create an awakened golem.
Your familiar is not telepathic. Early on the master and familiar develop an empathic link up to 1 mile distance but it only communicates general vague emotions.
A little towards mid levels your familiar can communicate with other animals of it's kind, so other rats, 7th level. It then also is able to communicate verbally with the master, 5th level.
At level 20 your familiar only has 15 int, at level 1-2 it has 6 int.
You need to be epic level to have it cast spells for you. There's also the solicit familiar spell but it doesn't do that autonomously. Normally feats and so on to improve familiars focus more on combat readiness closer to animal companion than on utility.
A Psion's psicrystal does have a telepathic link however, it starts out with it. At 5th level it can speak telepathically with other intelligent creatures.
At 15th level, up to 1 mile the Psion can manifest powers thru the psicrystal, to cast at distance. At epic levels the psicrystal can manifest it's own powers.
There are also most feats for psicrystals, to have them function as cognizance crystals, concentrate on maintained powers, multiple crystals, embedded, or even to house the master's soul after death to rebuild it's own body. These are pretty high level uses.
You can also craft meld psicrystals with various other items like weapons. Think a lightsaber, basically.
The psicrystal also starts with a personality fragment from the psion, and later starts to warp or change it, the persona gives an improvement like a familiar does. There's an aggressive personality in some supplement material that zaps the psion for damage (lol!) but gives a combat improvement.
Technically it might be possible with a handful of feats that don't exist in the game. With some evil cruelty you might be able to embed the psicrystal into the rat's brain and put the rat inside the golem. You could manifest a persisted schism which would then use your other mind to communicate with the crystal which controls the rat which controls the golem. You would probably also need practiced manifester too so you can use persisted power metapsionics. Using bend reality I imagine you could manifest arcane spells for power points via the rat too....
The only real problem is reconciling that (1) an arcane golem is animated by the "soul" of an elemental rather than psionic, and (2) not sure your rat can activate wands. The other problem is that since you took golem master you wouldn't have the feats or the levels to pull it off.
So technically it might be possible but it would be easier and cheaper to just create an awakened golem.
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*Pellease
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
I think this is a case where RP trumps mechanics. The server rule is that we play our Chars how we wish regardless of the Character Sheet. (Within reason.) I think in general people are fascinated by Rain and his rat golem.
I'm guessing he's a Cerebramancer? So between the fusion of magic and psionics (Or just psionics if he's pure) I think it's more than believable that he has somehow crafted what he has. Since GM is so gimped anyways as a class if you're keeping all 10 levels of it I'd say the RP is a nice pay-off. It also sounds like you're somewhat gimping your golem with the 1 wizard level on a race with a high ECL as it is.
If the image of you possessing the rat is what you want to go for with RP then go for it. If the image of a sort of mad scientist who has somehow implanted Strawberry's idea of a crystal in your rat familiar's brain, then go for it!
If you want to abide by the distance feature perhaps you can take a level of GC and RP that you are opening little portals around the golem so you can continue your psionic link. (Honestly, I think that's probably the hardest thing to believe in RP is that you are somehow projecting your thoughts across the planes. A GC lvl would allow you to pretty easily explain that away.)
You can even RP the golem glitching occasionally because you couldn't find a way to open a gate in a particular area. Maybe he can only go so far into a cave or can't enter the astral demi-plane's tower?
As for the original question of trading wands, I think the whole market value thing works great. If you want to try and avoid having to sell to everyone and their mother, consider making the prices really high since these are essentially prototypes. Most characters won't waste the money on your lab pieces when they can buy a magic wand from another merchant. Then just sell to your golem at the elevated price.
I'm guessing he's a Cerebramancer? So between the fusion of magic and psionics (Or just psionics if he's pure) I think it's more than believable that he has somehow crafted what he has. Since GM is so gimped anyways as a class if you're keeping all 10 levels of it I'd say the RP is a nice pay-off. It also sounds like you're somewhat gimping your golem with the 1 wizard level on a race with a high ECL as it is.
If the image of you possessing the rat is what you want to go for with RP then go for it. If the image of a sort of mad scientist who has somehow implanted Strawberry's idea of a crystal in your rat familiar's brain, then go for it!
If you want to abide by the distance feature perhaps you can take a level of GC and RP that you are opening little portals around the golem so you can continue your psionic link. (Honestly, I think that's probably the hardest thing to believe in RP is that you are somehow projecting your thoughts across the planes. A GC lvl would allow you to pretty easily explain that away.)
You can even RP the golem glitching occasionally because you couldn't find a way to open a gate in a particular area. Maybe he can only go so far into a cave or can't enter the astral demi-plane's tower?
As for the original question of trading wands, I think the whole market value thing works great. If you want to try and avoid having to sell to everyone and their mother, consider making the prices really high since these are essentially prototypes. Most characters won't waste the money on your lab pieces when they can buy a magic wand from another merchant. Then just sell to your golem at the elevated price.
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*Gazoo
- Posts: 145
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Although Rain's RP is very fun, the new character kind of circumvents the whole "one char/one set of stuff" concept.
It's similar to proposing that another toon is a sibling or part of an kindred organization. Families share, yes? etc.
Anyways, I'm pretty sure there is another player crafter/merchant handy such that things are never lacking.
(iirc, the sharing concept is allowed for a home for multiple characters, though..ie pooled gold to purchase)
It's similar to proposing that another toon is a sibling or part of an kindred organization. Families share, yes? etc.
Anyways, I'm pretty sure there is another player crafter/merchant handy such that things are never lacking.
(iirc, the sharing concept is allowed for a home for multiple characters, though..ie pooled gold to purchase)
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*Rainrix
- Posts: 38
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Well they're not linked all the time, only when in close proximity and with Rainrix's telepathy too. So a lot of the time Rainrix doesn't know exactly what Ikit is up to, and he doesn't really dig in their mind to find out. But I kind of go by some of Rainrix's personality has also rubbed off on Ikit. Plus Ikit does work to serve his master.
Intelligence though Ikit has more instinctive intelligence to a degree due to learning from Rainrix..? They'll know some things that Rainrix knows but not the hows or whys (More along the lines of, 'What armour is good, hazards of certain planes, how to deal with certain dangers). Also Ikit usually knows which people Rainrix trusts (As either Rainrix has shared that information with Ikit, or Ikit has been sat in his backpack a lot of the time he's interacted with them).
The golem itself appears mostly as an iron golem, but under the surface there's a mix of Mindsilver and Red Quartz too. It is also more heavily mechanical than a regular golem which is just animated metal, though the golem does have an elemental spirit attached to it that takes control when the pilot is under threat (Well when they're not inside the golem and under threat) or incapacitated. The 'wands' aren't actually wands... Mostly. Just using renamed wands to represent certain modules or built in weaponry. Hence why I can't just go buy wands off of some other random wand builder.
As for Rainrix's abilities, he's yeah 5 Wizard / 5 Psion / 10 Cerebremancer / 10 Golem Master. He can get maximum buffed 95 on crafting skills before rolling the D20 also... Okay kind of cheesy. 70 without the beardy Psion power (Though surely for extremely fine detail work he would use it every so often).
Probably more things to say but my mind has gone blank for the moment. Hah...
(EDIT: Oh yeah... And the other equipment Ikit has like their Brazen set and golem weapons they earned by themselves. So usual equipment has just been earned the correct way, it's just the wands / modules / abilities that is the thing I'm trying to trade)
Intelligence though Ikit has more instinctive intelligence to a degree due to learning from Rainrix..? They'll know some things that Rainrix knows but not the hows or whys (More along the lines of, 'What armour is good, hazards of certain planes, how to deal with certain dangers). Also Ikit usually knows which people Rainrix trusts (As either Rainrix has shared that information with Ikit, or Ikit has been sat in his backpack a lot of the time he's interacted with them).
The golem itself appears mostly as an iron golem, but under the surface there's a mix of Mindsilver and Red Quartz too. It is also more heavily mechanical than a regular golem which is just animated metal, though the golem does have an elemental spirit attached to it that takes control when the pilot is under threat (Well when they're not inside the golem and under threat) or incapacitated. The 'wands' aren't actually wands... Mostly. Just using renamed wands to represent certain modules or built in weaponry. Hence why I can't just go buy wands off of some other random wand builder.
As for Rainrix's abilities, he's yeah 5 Wizard / 5 Psion / 10 Cerebremancer / 10 Golem Master. He can get maximum buffed 95 on crafting skills before rolling the D20 also... Okay kind of cheesy. 70 without the beardy Psion power (Though surely for extremely fine detail work he would use it every so often).
Probably more things to say but my mind has gone blank for the moment. Hah...
(EDIT: Oh yeah... And the other equipment Ikit has like their Brazen set and golem weapons they earned by themselves. So usual equipment has just been earned the correct way, it's just the wands / modules / abilities that is the thing I'm trying to trade)
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*Strawberry Jam
- Posts: 441
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Generally magic and psionics don't combine well unless it's stated they do or a situation where they generally interact such as with dispel or power/spell resistance. If you had a mixed golem you would deal with vulnerabilities of both, places where one doesn't work would hinder the golem. So it would technically be better to stick to one. Cerebremancer also diminishes other features of either class, like all theurges, in order to progress casting of two your class features suffer.
But this is d&d where you also need multiple feats just to hold two objects in either hand.
Typically it would be better to have an autonomous familiar. The line of familiar feats can let you exchange for an animal companion which you can exchange for a humanoid shaped tiny/small celestial. You can also take the feat that bases your familiar on character level instead, and those without magic can take the feat that makes them eligible for arcane feats.
If you wanted an animated and functional automaton you would typically take craft(clockwork) I think, while the psionic constructs tend to use craft(sculpting), and regular arcane golems would be as they're stated. Crafting in d&d also takes a very long time like weeks so temp power/spells wouldn't normally be counted. The psionic one is normally used for a single reflexive check I believe.
Dismissals and other interferences would also ruin most of the mechanism too since familiars are a special extradimensional companion unlike the animal companion, and don't have golem immunities :lol:
Golems always carry out their last orders and then wait if left unattended.
Other characters kill gods or raise gods or travel back and forth into the future and past so I don't see a reason this should be an issue except the details make it sound more like a house of cards. The leadership feat is still always the easiest way to have an intelligent cohort act autonomously at a great distance.
You should probably try to flesh out some limitations or weaknesses to the rp to avoid jst being a sock puppet character. I think the same goes for anyone that plays their own familiar or own henchman.
But this is d&d where you also need multiple feats just to hold two objects in either hand.
Typically it would be better to have an autonomous familiar. The line of familiar feats can let you exchange for an animal companion which you can exchange for a humanoid shaped tiny/small celestial. You can also take the feat that bases your familiar on character level instead, and those without magic can take the feat that makes them eligible for arcane feats.
If you wanted an animated and functional automaton you would typically take craft(clockwork) I think, while the psionic constructs tend to use craft(sculpting), and regular arcane golems would be as they're stated. Crafting in d&d also takes a very long time like weeks so temp power/spells wouldn't normally be counted. The psionic one is normally used for a single reflexive check I believe.
Dismissals and other interferences would also ruin most of the mechanism too since familiars are a special extradimensional companion unlike the animal companion, and don't have golem immunities :lol:
Golems always carry out their last orders and then wait if left unattended.
Other characters kill gods or raise gods or travel back and forth into the future and past so I don't see a reason this should be an issue except the details make it sound more like a house of cards. The leadership feat is still always the easiest way to have an intelligent cohort act autonomously at a great distance.
You should probably try to flesh out some limitations or weaknesses to the rp to avoid jst being a sock puppet character. I think the same goes for anyone that plays their own familiar or own henchman.
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*Tingly
- Posts: 67
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
That's surprising. Would it also be considered valid if you sold something to another PC, then bought it from that same PC with a different character? I've been avoiding that situation.Mick64,Oct 2 2016 wrote: You are allowed to "buy" from your Alt so long as you're actually -buying-. So if your myPC 1 has a McGuffin that would be nice for your myPC 2, what I'd do is list my McGuffin publicly for price X for a few days. If nobody buys it, then I'd consider it okay for myPC 2 to buy it from myPC 1 for price X.
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*Strawberry Jam
- Posts: 441
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
I think there's a muling script that alerts dm's if you have an item that is previously owned. I'm not sure tho.
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*Mick64
- Posts: 490
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Only if that item has been publicly on sale for a while at the price you're paying.
The idea is that you can buy from PC merchants, even if that merchant is yours, because sometimes there's no merchants around. But that other PC should actually be a merchant, not a way to transfer items.
The idea is that you can buy from PC merchants, even if that merchant is yours, because sometimes there's no merchants around. But that other PC should actually be a merchant, not a way to transfer items.